I have asked Stages if it would fit and I got below response: "It will fit on the axle, but from what I am told from Cannondale, the offset is different between the SISL and the SISL2 & Si … But I would probably pick Stages again….Mainly due to the simple install. My question is, do those strain guages measure only the downward (push) force, or do they measure the complete rotational force of the lever (the crank arm)? 4iii, PowerTap G3 (and also the old Pro): Would I buy it: No problem at all here, as noted above – it’s probably the best deal for a complete (captures all power, not just left) power meter on the market today, primarily the NG ECO. Easily tracking my efforts. Many of the products in this post can produce just as consistently accurate power as SRM (which again, SRM is good at doing). In my Power2Max NG ECO in-depth review you’ll see that it does exceptionally well. I’m trying to retrofit an internal spin bike (Lifecycle GX) for Zwift. The addition of Bluetooth Smart into the DZero Units was much needed. Updated. Also, would you suggest the new bluetooth version from pioneer over the old pioneer version even though it seems like all versions can still connect to wahoo bolt and you mentioned computers wanting to default to ant+ connections with power meters anyways? As for $100 power meters, technically the PowerCal is there today at $49. Note that Stages technically sells three basic variants: Stages LR is dual-sided (hence, L = Left, R = Right), Stages L is left-side only, and Stages R is right-side only. Do you know what the model number is for the new pioneer power meters that have the bluetooth smart? SPD-pedals and the 2.5mm offset in the GRX crankset seems to limit available options. I haven’t received it yet, but was glad they were responsive. Just placed my order – what a great Black Friday deal! And if you have multiple bike types where the wheel type changes (i.e. Can be applied to most cranks (non-carbon). The Stage Cannondale Si HG 3rd generation power meter is easy to mount and can be installed on all Cannondale BB30 Si HG or SiSL2 cranksets. The Tax Neo has higher values. Thanks, Ray, great work. Link under “For those, start here with these posts.” is not working…. Running power meters don’t (well). Ray, SPD-pedals and the 2.5mm offset in the GRX crankset seems to limit available options.”. Contains both Bluetooth Smart and ANT+ (and dual-broadcasts). Back in March I ordered their newest Podium dual sided power meter. They used to be available overseas, though I’m not sure where to get them exactly these days. Were you able to find a 2019 version as i can’t seem to find one and would like to see what came out in the last year to buy something this black friday? At the ANT+ Symposium in early October 2018, the ANT+ Power Meter Technical Working Group (TWG) did finalize most of these metrics. You’ll thank me in time. I’d probably narrow down first where you plan to place the power meter (i.e. Starting off on straight road bikes, they’ve expanded to other areas including track and cross bikes. When a brand new Powertap cost $400, I could have bought an entirely new unit after just the past three seasons. The Favero Assioma DUO powermeter is now sub €700 in Europe for a couple of weeks already; seems to be a permanent price cut to me, because I noticed it on the factory website first at €695 and now on retailers websites for €685. As for the P1 pedals, they were announced in the spring of 2015 and started shipping in the summer of 2015. Some are linear and measure deflection in one direction. Is there a power meter pedal for MTB? Now that we’ve covered where each unit goes, let’s talk about the features that the power meters on the market have today. Agree, if you’re talking jagged graphs from a power meter – that’s spot-on perfect. Does anyone know of any non-wheel, non-crank, Speedplay supported Direct force power meter options that exist? It was US$318 instead of the usual $530. But, what about the brand vs brand issue, is the difference between the two really significant enough to worry about? Plus, I own an older Quarq Cinqo, then a Riken, and The Girl also uses the older Cinqo on her tri bike. » SRM X Power MTB Power Meter First Look: A Turning Point for SRM? While a handful of people on Wattage hate auto-zero, the reality is that aero facilities love it (and most consumers do as well) At least terms of substantial new products. 30C summers, and -30C winters. The look system does not deal well with mud…. Pioneer announces new color-mapping GPS bike computer, plus new power meters (September) Is this in line with you understanding of the commitment that, amongst others, Wahoo has expressed in October 2018? Advantages: One of the least expensive power meters on the market today from $399USD. And finally, I’m not going to talk about companies that have gone out of business (i.e. If you had a compatible crankset, then it was an astoundingly good option for the price (or any price). I desperately want to get into using power meters, but I cannot afford a space program, let alone the moon. Disadvantages: Limited to a single wheel, so training vs racing scenarios can be tough. Thanks for the great article (again). ± 2% of measured power Weight: Only adds 20g to base crank … But the entire point of the offset is to compensate for temperature drift. The underlying tech though is actually kinda interesting. The low-end keeps declining in price. I wanted to see if anyone else is having issues with Stages Gen 3 GXP power meters. Despite what the interwebs would tell you – it’s rather difficult getting a mass-produced accurate power meter, regardless of whether you’re a company with hundreds of millions in revenue (Garmin), or a startup (WatTeam). The power meter transmits total power (by doubling the left side), as well as cadence, via ANT+. without owning multiple power meters like yourself, how can you verify that your brand new power meter is giving you accurate numbers and not just a radndom number generator? These days Stages isn’t just left only, but dual as well. Shimano Dura-Ace R9100P Power Meter In-Depth Review (April) But there isn’t a specific timeframe for availability to my knowledge. It’s more about the angles at which the power is being applied. Thanks Mike – installing my unit this w/end. So a bandwith of 25-30W doesn’t seem unrealistic at all. For the past two-and-a-half years, I’ve been testing the Stages power meter on and off, letting a few friends try it out between my own testing. Hi Ray £149 is an amazing price :0). I eventually cancelled my order with them out of frustration. Completing the CAPTCHA proves you are a human and gives you temporary access to the web property. Finally, by way of non-drama items, Garmin is the only company that offers Cycling Dynamics today (though, that’s soon changing), which includes all assortment of metrics on your pedaling style. The spikes might have been fixed in a later firmware, though…. My own 4iiii left crank arm went kaput after just 1.5 years and 4iiii didn’t offer any support past telling me I could buy another one. I am asking how the measurement takes. 3. I can understand you take some precautions for Garmin V3. So I think pedals like your Garmin’s and my Assioma’s will report the power well regardless of temperature. Just my two cent…. Giant website says to deal with my shop. Of course, if I haven’t covered something – feel free to plop questions down below. What’s the best option now in July 2020, price no issue, just want the best: Stages power meters … Fear not, it’s easy for your bike shop though. We all are happy with it and use it a lot. I’m from out of the country and will be visiting the US, what’s the best triathlon shop in city XYZ? Thanks for such complete feedback, it really helps. Recently bought another bike with FSA SLK carbon cranks, which Avio unit won’t work with, so I need another option …… any thoughts from anyone on possible options pls? Pedal based power meters can probably tell whether the pedal is going up or down, since they probably include an accelerometer, but I don’t see why they’d do anything differently on the up stroke or down stroke. When it comes to numbers, I only had a few rides on which I used both the PowerTap and 4iiiis. One major disadvantage of pedal powermeters (like Garmin’s Vector): vulnerability! Auto-zero while coasting helps keep things in check without you thinking about it. Updated constantly! The pod attaches to a left crank arm in a similar manner to Stages or 4iiii, though, a bit longer in length than either of those companies. While I’ve written plenty on them over the years, with this announcement I wouldn’t recommend purchasing them, primarily because the unit is so heavily dependent on not just their mobile app, but backend servers that do calibration and configuration. I use the dual caps on my units without issue across a wide number of devices. While there are some apps out there that can attempt to do the same thing, none of them re-transmit back over ANT+, so the data isn’t included on your bike computer. Any indication when a Vector 4 might be release? I like the concept, but I’m not sold on the current pricing model. This year was true as well as the company rolled out a major refresh for their power meter lineup, adding in Bluetooth Smart support and increased waterproofing – as well as a smartphone app for configuration and data download. They maintained their price point at $799USD for a dual system (sending in your own cranks), as well as other single-sided and pre-built with cranks already attached options as well. Our Stages Power meter is the singular product that will bring power measurement and … Some reviews are over 60 pages long when printed out, with hundreds of photos! You’ll never hit that before you move on to something else. What’s worse is I can’t seem to get anybody to help me fix it. They’re in the market, available today for purchase and you can more or less install them today on the bike. Oh, and free US shipping too! If 6mm, you want a non-boost power meter … This power meter is fantastic. Good question. Like I said, I don’t know how they do it. When this didn’t work it was deemed dead but they did offer me a 20% discount to buy another one. I was a big reluctant before the purchase, but I got a good deal and took the plunge (from a distributor which sells the whole crankset already mounted with PM). I've been testing for a while now and think it still has some work to do. The only difference to be aware of is that the two companies sell different crank arm configurations, and in the case of FSA you have to pay extra for a firmware update to enable Bluetooth Smart. Relevant Posts: PowerTap P2 pedals announced, PowerTap lowers P1 pedal price to $999, matches Garmin Vector 3, PowerTap P1 Power Meter Pedals In-Depth Review, First rides with the PowerTap P1 Pedals & PowerTap C1 Chainring…and more, PowerTap announces P1 Power Meter Pedals, also PowerTap C1 chainring unit. However, while I was waiting for the Stages battery covers to come in, I ordered a 4iiii Podium left side power meter because at the time I thought that I didn’t want to deal with coin cell battery covers coming off and getting lost, so enter the rechargeable USB port Podiiiium power meter. Disadvantages: For crank arms, you’re somewhat limited to certain cranksets though that has definitely improved. At the same time that PowerTap introduced their new P1 pedals in the spring of 2015, they also announced a new line – the C1 chainring power meter. Before we start diving into the brands, features, and functionality, we should probably talk about placement. That made me mad, as my hubs will become obsolete. Cannondale Hollowgram SL Crankset (North County) $299. Have you upgraded the firmware? You may need to download version 2.0 now from the Chrome Web Store. I have two 4iiii precision power meters. It seems like with Powertap C1 no longer being supported (my current power meter), I’m out of luck for power meter options? My Quarq Dzero has even high output. From an anecdotal standpoint, the number of people having issues has almost completely dissolved (between a combination of the new battery pods/caps and software updates). The company hasn’t stopped there though. So i decided to cancel my subscription and ditch the unit. I do about 10% of my riding on my 2003 Litespeed Vortex with Shimano Dura Ace components from that time (9 speed)(the bike fit is not ideal and the gearing doesn’t suit me anymore as this area has no flat roads, lots of short, super steep hills, and I am 48 yo and 200 lbs instead of 28 yo and 155). Not on the US site unfortunately. I’d hoped by now we’d have seen some science-like papers or something that showed the value of these, but nothing has happened in that realm – a number of years on. Cycling Dynamics: This was initially Garmin’s suite of Garmin Vector specific features that enable data such as platform offset and where in the stroke your power is coming from (power phase), as well as seated and standing position. Actually, as you can see from the above comment, you can upgrade by purchasing the R only. Some products are only available in the UK at this point and time, however, the company has started expanding into the EU this week for others. https://www.dcrainmaker.com/2018/11/power-meter-buyers-2018.html Long Term Review: Stages Cycling crank arm power meter. Ray, Great write up! I travel a fair bit, both for work and for fun. Hi Ray, I’ve been using your analyzer for some time to check if my power meters give the same values. These significantly increased transmission over ANT+ & Bluetooth Smart, hoping to resolve connectivity issues that have challenged many Stages owners over the years. Is the range a few watts, or are we potentially in the 35-40W range? Anybody knows when Favero will launch the firmware update containing cycling dynamics? Cannot compare it to any other PMs, but it works very well IMO. I kinda put the PowerTap C1, Power2Max and Quarq units all in the same boat: All are great options and all are fairly similar in features  (and roughly in the same price range) – simply go with whatever fits your requirements around compatibility best. My experience with Team Zwatt left-sided Zimanox: While the readings during a single ride seem stable and reasonable, the day to day difference is huge. You can’t measure it directly at the spider, instead you have to measure it upstream of that such as the cranks (Stages LR, ROTOR dual system, Infocrank’s dual system, Pioneer’s dual system, WatTeam dual, Shimano’s dual system, 4iiii’s dual system), pedals (Garmin, Favero Assioma/bePRO, Polar/Look, SRM/Look pedals). Any hope of seeing some SRM SPD-compatible pedals soon? Two years ago at Eurobike they introduced the DZero generation of units, which slightly increased accuracy but more importantly added Bluetooth Smart compatibility/connectivity. Whereas with the P2M NG ECO unit it comes with it. Now I have used it for several years without ever having a single problem other than changing batteries maybe once a year. It’s like non-identical twin siblings (of the same gender). As I noted in the post, I think they have the potential to have a solid product if they can make it a bit more consumer/bike shop friendly. Additionally, they also have dual ANT+ & Bluetooth Smart transmission. However I can’t understand why you are so positive about the P1 pedals. Thanks, All other things being equal Ray, would you buy Infocrank or Rotor? Note that all bottom-bracket power meters are left-only power. Seriously, nobody. They may have slight backorders if you were to order today, but units are shipping to consumers (which is where I draw the line). Which one would you recommend? All-in it ends up being more expensive than Power2Max – which has more compatibility offerings than Team Zwatt. Worse is that powertap have no interest in assisting me. Based on what I’ve seen, the PowerTap is the closest I get to ‘set it and forget it’ when it comes to power meters on the market today (talking specifically to calibration/offset variance and stability). Stages Cycling Power L CANNONDALE Hollowgram Si Power Meter Currently love my Quarq DZero – fit and forget accuracy, and have two road bike and a CX set up with the same BB so swapping takes less than a minute. If 6mm, you want a non-boost power meter spider. I reviewed them as well this past summer and found their accuracy solid (and moveability also solid). Shimano So keep in mind this is just my view. Think my written reviews are deep? They’re strain gauges. If 3mm, you want a boost power meter spider. 1. I also just put together my complete ‘Gear I Use’ equipment list, from swim to bike to run and everything in between (plus a few extra things). Same goes for watches from Suunto and Polar. Hi Jose, I have Vector 3S and have couple of friends that has it. Here’s a bunch of random trip reports and daily trip-logs that I’ve put together and posted. These units are well regarded and stable, and it’s what I initially put on my new bike last winter (seen above). Pioneer has iterated nicely through three generations of power meters over the last five years, plus other crankset models, roughly paced at a new set of models per year. Identical experience with 4iiii. Am I the only one here or is there something spooky about the Pioneer Powermeter? Then there’s a list of companies that I don’t see as being in business anymore – either because they’ve said so, or because they’ve gone silent. i could have a defective unit that’s reporting +10% or whatever, and i would probably never know. I used the unit quite a bit across multiple seasons and into the winter without any issue. Please post the links so we can enjoy the benefits of all your hard work. Finally, there’s been a handful of folks that have seen issues with play in the spindle, though that’s largely dissipated in the two years. They did, however, admit the bearings had failed. The vector mapping capability of the Pioneer cyclecomputer also is incredibly valuable to me. The company keeps adding new features over time. Any ideas?? They also shift from coin cell battery to rechargeable, but those initially will only be focused on disc-brake wheels and not regular wheels. The power meter features +/- 1.5% accuracy and 200 hours of battery life. But I also know folks and have friends that have basically chucked their Vector 3 pedals against the largest wall they can find. It seems like your post says $999 when sending in your own crank. Need to add Watts but desperately want to keep my Speedplay pedals (knee issues so need the float). Ergomo, Brim Brothers), or products that haven’t been made in a long while (i.e. My old rear wheel will be dedicated to a Stac Zero Halcyon ( and it’s weights) each winter. It handles everything I throw at it with ease. Black Friday deal. I ended up returning them as compared to my KICKR the power wasn’t accurate or consistent. I currently have a Stages L (Gen 1) and am wanting to get to true LR power. For BB30 riders Stages offers a power meter as an upgrade for existing Cannondale Hollowgram SI model cranks. The 3rd generation of Stages is 6 times stronger than its predecessor. The company started shipping units in mid-2017, however, accuracy never quite got to the point of being accurate enough for meaningful usage. Pioneer It’s been more than two years since Shimano debuted their Dura-Ace integrated power meter. However, I do want to highlight the PowerPod as being one that for the right consumer I would recommend. On the first set, the right pedal simply stopped transmitting. Like the cannondale si for the off road cannondale scalpel? I would not recommend Vector 3 pedals and being one of the owners with issues, I'm sad to see Ray recommend them. This means that as a regular consumer, as of the date of this publishing, you can’t actually get your hands on one quite yet (though, some do offer pre-order options). Pioneer I was looking for something more reliable than my Vector2 pedals and after a lot of research went with Infocrank. One nearly 2 years old and the other just under 1 year old. I'm fairly certain it will require the non-boost (the first F-Si and the Scalpel-Si do). This past winter Specialized decided to get into the power meter game themselves. But switching to Vector 3 was my worst decision this year, and I ended up with 2 tries, one pair and then another one, that failed. It’s what Team Sky has actually been using for years in testing. But, just from the perspective of the difference between the two brands, do you think there really is that much difference between a 4iiii and Stages when both measure power from the same area? The core differences include a far greater weather-sealed pod, which Specialized said they did to appeal to their pro teams using pressure washers to clean bikes. I am new to Power Meters, and am teaming up with a cycle coach for a winter training program. Bsquared: Correct. Did you do a comparison on the weight of each power meter? These days we’ve got four core running power meters (Stryd, RunScribe, Garmin, Polar), and none of them match (even remotely). The power meter has changed how I train, climb, and think on the bike (and recover off it). Quarq Elsa to D-Zero), I’m lumping them together with differences noted in that section. Again, just seat of the pants and no direct comparisons. Up until last year, other manufacturers couldn’t display this, but Garmin has effectively opened the standard up last fall, however at present it’s yet to be implemented. In short these users have advised others to steer clear. Even if either do update the model in the next few months, the favero assioma and vector 3 are still good power meters and worth the money right? DFPMs, on the other hand, would be varied as some are single sided and others are double sided and would also depend upon where they are placed. This past summer SRM introduced not just a pedal-based power meter, but the technology platform for what the company views as the next evolution of all their power meters. You can get a C1 in 53/39, 52/36, or 50/36 combinations, but no 50/34. Relevant Posts: Power2Max NG Power Meter In-Depth Review, Power2Max NG ECO In-Depth Review, A look at the new Power2Max NG power meters, The Power2Max Type S Power Meter In-Depth Review, Power2Max drops prices…again. Thus, if you ask someone for “the best power meter”, and they give you any answer other than “it depends”, don’t trust that person. Should work well with MTB as well. This wasn’t necessarily a surprise as all components will fatigue, but he claimed that this could happen in as little as a few months and after that the readings could essentially be so inaccurate as to be useless. Last social media posts were mid-2017. Of course, Giant is a big company and has plenty of resources to get the job done. Dual-leg: The SBT91 (Dura) and SBT80 (Ultegra). Either the older yet reliable Type S, comes with Rotor 3D and rings, so it’s an all inclusive for 680€. I hope both the 4iiiis and Pioneer give me many ling years of flawless performance. By power meter standards, the way Stages derive your power figure is relatively straightforward, and they believe this simplicity ultimately leads to accuracy. I had from the outset requested a full refund. I take things to a whole new level of interactive depth! My trainer is in the garage, and over winter it will get down to single digit temperatures. Getting clear and concise answers out of the company at Eurobike is always tricky. To be fair, Samsung and Huawei do pretty nonstandard stuff with their bluetooth management. Add power to an existing 2014 Cannondale Hollowgram SI 3D forged crank by selecting the length of the non-drive power meter to match an existing crank. But then again, you probably already knew that. based on you comment that during the ANT+ Power Meter Technical Working Group in October 2018 various companies, including Wahoo, have commited to support cycling dynamics, I have reached out to Wahoo when they would issue a firmware update to make this happen for the Elemnt Bolt. Alternatively, for everything else on the planet, simply buy your goods from Amazon via the link below and I get a tiny bit back as an Amazon Associate. Generally speaking for me to consider it, it’s gotta be both available in an EU or North American market (with plans to expand globally), and support has to be provided in those markets. I bought recharge-able batteries, and swap them out when needed (which is way less often then I would have thought). In general, I’d recommend this for someone that may be buying a heart rate strap anyway and is interested in power (since it’s down to $49 these days). What’s up with that? Wanna save some cash and support the site? Has a carbon crank-arm offering. The Cannondale Hollowgram SI Stages Power is a BB30 compatible upgrade for existing Cannondale 2014 Hollowgram SI model cranks. They support the older generation units for pedaling metrics just the same as newer. ” ( 148mm ) too worried measurement devices good catch, i prefer mountain bike run. Accuracy standpoint was very strong in all directions and after a year only! 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